OGS.....

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bman2
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2 months ago

What annoys me about the situation in the club now is that it feels like Ole has to lose 15 games in a row for the club and a lot of fans to decide we need a change. Why can’t we just have the high standards of a top club? Ole’s not shit. He’s not a failure. Far from it. But if that’s the standard, that we can only sack a manager if they are totally incompetent, we’re never going to get anywhere.

The question should be is he good enough? Everything I’ve seen over the last two years suggests that we’ll keep on as we are. Being ok. Losing matches we shouldn’t lose. Having some good wins too, usually coming in time to “save the manager’s job”.

Why can’t we just decide that Ole’s been ok, he’s done a service to the club, we’ve had probably the best moments since Fergie under him, but that we need a more experienced and higher caliber manager to get us back to the too tier of club football. It’s not that strange a suggestion: it’s not like he had the CV of a top manager.
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dozer
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2 months ago

bman2 wrote:
2 months ago
What annoys me about the situation in the club now is that it feels like Ole has to lose 15 games in a row for the club and a lot of fans to decide we need a change. Why can’t we just have the high standards of a top club? Ole’s not shit. He’s not a failure. Far from it. But if that’s the standard, that we can only sack a manager if they are totally incompetent, we’re never going to get anywhere.

The question should be is he good enough? Everything I’ve seen over the last two years suggests that we’ll keep on as we are. Being ok. Losing matches we shouldn’t lose. Having some good wins too, usually coming in time to “save the manager’s job”.

Why can’t we just decide that Ole’s been ok, he’s done a service to the club, we’ve had probably the best moments since Fergie under him, but that we need a more experienced and higher caliber manager to get us back to the too tier of club football. It’s not that strange a suggestion: it’s not like he had the CV of a top manager.
Jose and Gaal were higher tier. Ole did better
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bman2
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2 months ago

dozer wrote:
2 months ago
bman2 wrote:
2 months ago
What annoys me about the situation in the club now is that it feels like Ole has to lose 15 games in a row for the club and a lot of fans to decide we need a change. Why can’t we just have the high standards of a top club? Ole’s not shit. He’s not a failure. Far from it. But if that’s the standard, that we can only sack a manager if they are totally incompetent, we’re never going to get anywhere.

The question should be is he good enough? Everything I’ve seen over the last two years suggests that we’ll keep on as we are. Being ok. Losing matches we shouldn’t lose. Having some good wins too, usually coming in time to “save the manager’s job”.

Why can’t we just decide that Ole’s been ok, he’s done a service to the club, we’ve had probably the best moments since Fergie under him, but that we need a more experienced and higher caliber manager to get us back to the too tier of club football. It’s not that strange a suggestion: it’s not like he had the CV of a top manager.
Jose and Gaal were higher tier. Ole did better
That’s simply not true, and quite obviously so. The won silverware. They got more points in the league. Ole took a team that got 82 points, spent a decent amount of money on still more players, and got 66 points. Now, we can look at some of the matches and say that subjectively, in our opinion, the football is better. But the reality is that going by whatever objective measures are available to us — points, silverware — Ole is doing worse that his predecessors.
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swampash
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2 months ago

Bman's CV comment is right on the money. We increasingly look like we are being managed by someone who's skill set is limited by the experience of having only managed low-lights like Molde and Cardiff City.
From ghoulies and ghosties and long-leggedy beasties and things that go bump in the night, Good Lord deliver us...and while you're at it, a bit of a helping hand with hobbits wouldn't go amiss...
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Sid
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2 months ago

Thing is the Ole or any other manager couldn't build on what Mourinho left cos there was nothing left. He'd destroyed the foundations. Players didn't want to play. Fans turned on them and each other. Chaos on the pitch. He had Rashford and Martial training & playing as wingbacks. Cos he plays in such a unique way - literally a back 10 against relegation teams - that there aren't many other managers that can build on that cos things are done differently now.

It was a case of starting again. Learning how to pass the ball, on the floor, and forwards. And tbf Ole has done that. Yes there's some shite but Ole will leave behind a better, happier squad for the next manager. We've finally got a strong midfield with options, and some great forwards that play great football. Ditch Static for someone more agile and quick, sign a quick CB and boom we can play a high line, condense the play and be aggressive.
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swampash
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2 months ago

There's a bit more to it though, Sid, than being the squad's best mate. And I think trying to be their best mate is part of what is holding us back.
Why for instance is van de Beek not getting the games he plainly deserves? I have a HUGE problem with the 'double 6' formula he keeps sticking to. McT and Fred play, essentially, the same role. We need a 'double 6' combo where one player is delegated to advance well up the field, not least to provide the link to Bruno. vdB looks like the player to do just that. Just playing two horizontally linked d6's leaves a gaping hole in midfield and results in hoof ball football to the isolated attack.
That the hobbit cannot see this is part of the reason I think he is tactically challenged. You are dead right about our needing a swift CB but that will not of itself solve the problem of a weak manager.
From ghoulies and ghosties and long-leggedy beasties and things that go bump in the night, Good Lord deliver us...and while you're at it, a bit of a helping hand with hobbits wouldn't go amiss...
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dozer
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1 month ago

bman2 wrote:
1 year ago
Arteta shows already what a modern coaching manager can do. Even during the bounce, it never looked like Ole had instilled a compelling style of play, he just changed the mood from Mourinho's low point and let the attacking players run. We desperately need a manager who coaches creative, penetrating play and makes individual players better.
Arteta :vampire:
Parks more buses than Jose and yet manages to concede.
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Sid
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1 month ago

dozer wrote:
1 month ago
bman2 wrote:
1 year ago
Arteta shows already what a modern coaching manager can do. Even during the bounce, it never looked like Ole had instilled a compelling style of play, he just changed the mood from Mourinho's low point and let the attacking players run. We desperately need a manager who coaches creative, penetrating play and makes individual players better.
Arteta :vampire:
Parks more buses than Jose and yet manages to concede.
Aye the spanish Allardyce hasn't got long cos Arsenal are shit but not that shit. They're 14th at the min
fat maradona
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1 month ago

Sid wrote:
1 month ago
dozer wrote:
1 month ago
bman2 wrote:
1 year ago
Arteta shows already what a modern coaching manager can do. Even during the bounce, it never looked like Ole had instilled a compelling style of play, he just changed the mood from Mourinho's low point and let the attacking players run. We desperately need a manager who coaches creative, penetrating play and makes individual players better.
Arteta :vampire:
Parks more buses than Jose and yet manages to concede.
Aye the spanish Allardyce hasn't got long cos Arsenal are shit but not that shit. They're 14th at the min
fucking hilarious, not so long ago you had many a pundit saying how good Arteta was and now....well, such is the fickle nature of football punditry....
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bman2
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1 month ago

We’ve got a huge squad with a lot of expensive players in it now. We really should be competing for the title with this squad. I didn’t quite notice until now just how stacked it is.

Forwards: Cavani, Rashford, Martial, Greenwood, Ighalo, James, the new 18 year olds...
Midfield: Pogba, Bruno, Mata, Van de Beek, Matic, McTominay, Fred, is Pereira still about?

I go through all the defenders. But we’ve a fuck load. Sure there’s a few players you’d like here or there. Another quality forward, a more dynamic DM, and so on. But it’s a hell of a squad, with a lot of options.

At what point will it be decided that Ole is expected to actually compete for silverware? How many more players does he need?
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